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[LegendaryAngel]

   Hello,
     Small yet big problem.

 When I take in a deep breath and try to relax, my heart tends to beat faster, and with little sounds and distractions, it gets jittery. And for some reason, when mediating and trying to focus my energies, I tense up for some reason....

 What could this be?

 LA

[issacweirdo]

   Hello,
     Small yet big problem.

 When I take in a deep breath and try to relax, my heart tends to beat faster, and with little sounds and distractions, it gets jittery. And for some reason, when mediating and trying to focus my energies, I tense up for some reason....

 What could this be?

I don't know, but the same things happen to me. Every time I take a deep breath my heart quickens rather than slow down, while the sounds it makes are certainly loud. I incorporate the noises it makes into my occasional meditation though, since for the very same reason it is also easy to zone in on. I don't tense up whenever I do meditation though.

[LegendaryAngel]

 Perhaps I'm breathing in too deeply, if thats even possible. Do I have to take deep breaths to relax?

[issacweirdo]

Perhaps I'm breathing in too deeply, if thats even possible. Do I have to take deep breaths to relax?

It honestly shouldn't matter, in the beginning. Usually once you enter a pretty deep state of mind you lose awareness of your own breathing. Once this stage occurs then you should be breathing deeply on your own, assuming you don't have any inhalation problems. Try shortening your breaths and see if it helps. The main reasons why a lot of meditation techniques advise the practitioner to focus on their breathing are for two primary reasons: 1) Taking deep breaths usually makes the individual relax, and 2) you start to make a habit of being mindful towards your own breathing. The second reason helps to offer a quick get-away to relaxation land ( ) if you are in a stressful situation; I'm pretty sure there are other beneficial reasons for reason 2.

In summary, if the method isn't working for you then change it around. Try to make it such that the method fits who you are. You have trouble deepening your breath, so avoid that in the future if you don't want to work on it. What is usually required, and incredibly helpful, is if you physically feel comfortable.

[LegendaryAngel]

  Thank you for all the helpful advice! I will be trying these!
 
  LA

[issacweirdo]

  Thank you for all the helpful advice! I will be trying these!
 
  LA

No problem

Just do me a favor and tell me the results please! I actually want to know if my advice helped or not (I'm assuming it will, but I have been wrong in the past).

[Notagh]

You're doing it wrong!  I don't know about you but if I try to relax I rarely succeed.  Relaxation is not an active thing you do, it is a passive state you achieve.  Like I said about a meditation where you focus on not moving.  That's all great when you're aiming for focal meditation.  For relaxing meditation, you should have no focus, and no thought.  Don't try to force relaxation.  

Relax, for crying out loud!  xD

And stop caring if your heart is beating faster or whatever.  You have to let yourself go.  You have to stop thinking about your heart beating or whatever.  You're relaxed!  Don't even notice it.

[issacweirdo]

You're doing it wrong!  I don't know about you but if I try to relax I rarely succeed.  Relaxation is not an active thing you do, it is a passive state you achieve.  Like I said about a meditation where you focus on not moving.  That's all great when you're aiming for focal meditation.  For relaxing meditation, you should have no focus, and no thought.  Don't try to force relaxation.  

Relax, for crying out loud!  xD

And stop caring if your heart is beating faster or whatever.  You have to let yourself go.  You have to stop thinking about your heart beating or whatever.  You're relaxed!  Don't even notice it.

Easier said than done. Relaxation can be induced through physical means as well. Tense up all your muscles and then let go; you're well onto your way of being physically relaxed. While I agree being relaxed is indeed a passive state, the means to achieve it are certainly not. He's trying to induce the feelings of being relaxed, which by its very nature requires action, or lack of action (which usually requires action since most people are in a nasty habit to constantly think/worry). Seriously, I have never met any person who claims it's easy to relax with no thought or constant action and pull it off (especially if it's a beginner). There are situations where relaxation must be forced, though the act of forcing relaxation does not require visible effort. In the long run, it's not recommended to force relaxation. I'm assuming he's a beginner if he's asking for help on how to initially relax though. In this certain situation asking someone to "let go and relax" is practically saying "just do it" method; virtually lacking in information and very confusing.

I agree that paying too much attention to his heart in meditation isn't necessary; in his circumstance, it gets in the way. For educational purposes then? Ha ha ha.

[LegendaryAngel]

 Interesting thoughts. I have been trying (or lack thereof) to relax, and I am getting some mixed results so I'm on the right track.


 Oh, by the way...I'm a girl....

[issacweirdo]

Interesting thoughts. I have been trying (or lack thereof) to relax, and I am getting some mixed results so I'm on the right track.


 Oh, by the way...I'm a girl....

I stand corrected. No offense, but I still probably won't remember. For future reference don't get too pissed if I screw up once in a while, ha ha ha.

[LegendaryAngel]

Hahaha, that's fine. You can't really tell online anyway!

[Mech]

If it really is distracting, try to single out what "tenses you up". Then don't do those things =P. Just let your body go limp. Make your breathing slow, deepness isn't the point; the point is speed. Relaxing your body relaxes your mind, or so I've observed.

[The Adfeng]

For myself I just tell myself to calm down.  I can get pretty mellow even without meditation.  But I think that's just because that's how I am or maybe I've just done it for so long that I can calm myself down fairly quickly.

[Notagh]

You're doing it wrong!  I don't know about you but if I try to relax I rarely succeed.  Relaxation is not an active thing you do, it is a passive state you achieve.  Like I said about a meditation where you focus on not moving.  That's all great when you're aiming for focal meditation.  For relaxing meditation, you should have no focus, and no thought.  Don't try to force relaxation.  

Relax, for crying out loud!  xD

And stop caring if your heart is beating faster or whatever.  You have to let yourself go.  You have to stop thinking about your heart beating or whatever.  You're relaxed!  Don't even notice it.

Easier said than done. Relaxation can be induced through physical means as well. Tense up all your muscles and then let go; you're well onto your way of being physically relaxed. While I agree being relaxed is indeed a passive state, the means to achieve it are certainly not. He's trying to induce the feelings of being relaxed, which by its very nature requires action, or lack of action (which usually requires action since most people are in a nasty habit to constantly think/worry).

  I don't know if I was unclear in my post or if I didn't get your post, but here goes.  To relax is a negative effort for me, in that is is a (meta?)effort being committed to stop perceptible effort on my part.  I guess you could say closing a door from a deeper layer inside.  Thus, to me, the means to achieving it, while requiring action, is not really an action per se..

[issacweirdo]

I don't know if I was unclear in my post or if I didn't get your post, but here goes.  To relax is a negative effort for me, in that is is a (meta?)effort being committed to stop perceptible effort on my part.  I guess you could say closing a door from a deeper layer inside.  Thus, to me, the means to achieving it, while requiring action, is not really an action per se..

Well, I think you're not exactly understanding my point, ha ha ha. I'm not saying the person should place effort into making it seem as if they are placing no effort; rather, when somebody is physically relaxed then usually mental relaxation follows soon in pursuit. It's not guaranteed to work for everybody, but in most cases it gets the job done. While simply doing and thinking nothing induces relaxation extremely quickly, the actual process is more difficult than forcing yourself to mentally relax. In most cases, only advanced and experienced practitioners can quiet their mind and body in a relatively short amount of time. I even state it in my 2nd to last post:

He's trying to induce the feelings of being relaxed, which by its very nature requires action, or lack of action (which usually requires action since most people are in a nasty habit to constantly think/worry)

The keyword I use is "usually", since I know it's possible for some individuals to make no conscious effort to relax, meaning they can simply let their mind and body do nothing in a snap. For the majority of people, instead of letting the mind do nothing they spend their free time thinking/worrying about mundane things. Usually the whole "no action" relaxation method requires the person to change their daily habits, which can take a while. You also have to remember the OP is a beginner; they also have a hard time trying to ignore their own heartbeat, showing how much improvement they still need to zone out distractions. In other words, I'm not saying you're wrong. Rather, I'm saying the OP is still too inexperienced to naturally, if that's the right word, relax without conscious effort, something that you can obviously achieve.

Now to the whole "doing action to achieve a lack of action". In essence, this statement is a paradox, since ultimately the person is still committing an action. If this point is where your main confusion lies, then let me re-phrase the statement: "the individual must change their habits of thinking/worrying at all times, which requires action, to a habit of mentally and physically relaxing the moment they have free time, which if done correctly turns into a habit and no longer requires conscious action". The following analogy might help clarify my words: walking requires no conscious effort, since we have done it so many times that it feels natural, turning the action of walking into a habit==>Automatic. She can't relax without conscious effort, the main point I'm trying to argue. Due to her lack of experience, conscious effort is then required.

An example of physical relaxation without perceivable effort is changing the rate at which you breath. Taking slow, semi-deep/deep breaths is hard to pick-up from an external standpoint.

Finally to address the last point in my 2nd to last post: Forcing relaxation all the time isn't recommended. If an individual starts to make a habit of using physical methods to relax then they begin to depend on those certain methods. Once they can relax with no problem with physical methods can they begin to slowly transition to mental methods, which hopefully will start to become a habit. Decreasing the frequency of usage of those particular methods little by little tends to lack a drastic difference in each session of meditation. Through time it gets to the point where the individual can stop doing the methods all-together==>at that point they can remember the feeling of relaxation and it should come on the majority of time. This is more of an assumption though, since at least for me remembering the feeling of relaxation usually gets me relaxed, physically and mentally speaking, pronto.

[LegendaryAngel]

  I've read your posts and I agree with what you're saying. Yes, my inexperience leads me to have to consciously relax. Even worse, I tend to fall asleep. It's not even that I'm relaxed so to say, it's more that my head goes numb and I have to take a nap, it's strange...

[issacweirdo]

  I've read your posts and I agree with what you're saying. Yes, my inexperience leads me to have to consciously relax. Even worse, I tend to fall asleep. It's not even that I'm relaxed so to say, it's more that my head goes numb and I have to take a nap, it's strange...

Are you getting enough sleep? If so, then try to meditate during the daytime, assuming that you don't. If you have already done all of the things I've mentioned then get into an uncomfortable position in purpose so that you won't fall asleep. Beginners usually tend to fall asleep when they try to meditate, so don't get too down on the result.

[LegendaryAngel]

  Mmm, ok. I do get enough sleep, but for whatever reason, I always get tired when I try to relax. I feel that my body is against me. Sorry if this is whining at this point.

[issacweirdo]

  Mmm, ok. I do get enough sleep, but for whatever reason, I always get tired when I try to relax. I feel that my body is against me. Sorry if this is whining at this point.

It is whining, but everybody whines once in a while. At least the reason for your whining is justified, ha ha ha. While for meditation you do you want to be able to focus on the task at hand, falling asleep pretty much defeats the purpose. For the time being 1) try to extend the amount of time you can stay awake before falling asleep while meditating and 2) try to find the most uncomfortable position that you can, while still allowing you to meditate without too much problems.

[Notagh]

I don't know if I was unclear in my post or if I didn't get your post, but here goes.  To relax is a negative effort for me, in that is is a (meta?)effort being committed to stop perceptible effort on my part.  I guess you could say closing a door from a deeper layer inside.  Thus, to me, the means to achieving it, while requiring action, is not really an action per se..

Well, I think you're not exactly understanding my point, ha ha ha. I'm not saying the person should place effort into making it seem as if they are placing no effort; rather, when somebody is physically relaxed then usually mental relaxation follows soon in pursuit. It's not guaranteed to work for everybody, but in most cases it gets the job done. While simply doing and thinking nothing induces relaxation extremely quickly, the actual process is more difficult than forcing yourself to mentally relax. In most cases, only advanced and experienced practitioners can quiet their mind and body in a relatively short amount of time. I even state it in my 2nd to last post:

He's trying to induce the feelings of being relaxed, which by its very nature requires action, or lack of action (which usually requires action since most people are in a nasty habit to constantly think/worry)

The keyword I use is "usually", since I know it's possible for some individuals to make no conscious effort to relax, meaning they can simply let their mind and body do nothing in a snap. For the majority of people, instead of letting the mind do nothing they spend their free time thinking/worrying about mundane things. Usually the whole "no action" relaxation method requires the person to change their daily habits, which can take a while. You also have to remember the OP is a beginner; they also have a hard time trying to ignore their own heartbeat, showing how much improvement they still need to zone out distractions. In other words, I'm not saying you're wrong. Rather, I'm saying the OP is still too inexperienced to naturally, if that's the right word, relax without conscious effort, something that you can obviously achieve.

Now to the whole "doing action to achieve a lack of action". In essence, this statement is a paradox, since ultimately the person is still committing an action. If this point is where your main confusion lies, then let me re-phrase the statement: "the individual must change their habits of thinking/worrying at all times, which requires action, to a habit of mentally and physically relaxing the moment they have free time, which if done correctly turns into a habit and no longer requires conscious action". The following analogy might help clarify my words: walking requires no conscious effort, since we have done it so many times that it feels natural, turning the action of walking into a habit==>Automatic. She can't relax without conscious effort, the main point I'm trying to argue. Due to her lack of experience, conscious effort is then required.

An example of physical relaxation without perceivable effort is changing the rate at which you breath. Taking slow, semi-deep/deep breaths is hard to pick-up from an external standpoint.

Finally to address the last point in my 2nd to last post: Forcing relaxation all the time isn't recommended. If an individual starts to make a habit of using physical methods to relax then they begin to depend on those certain methods. Once they can relax with no problem with physical methods can they begin to slowly transition to mental methods, which hopefully will start to become a habit. Decreasing the frequency of usage of those particular methods little by little tends to lack a drastic difference in each session of meditation. Through time it gets to the point where the individual can stop doing the methods all-together==>at that point they can remember the feeling of relaxation and it should come on the majority of time. This is more of an assumption though, since at least for me remembering the feeling of relaxation usually gets me relaxed, physically and mentally speaking, pronto.

Ha ha ha?...            Off topic here but that scared me a little xD

I more or less agree with your clarified points there.  Not too concentrating at the moment so I didn't read carefully but I skimmed and I agree. (More or less.)
"  Mmm, ok. I do get enough sleep, but for whatever reason, I always get tired when I try to relax. I feel that my body is against me. Sorry if this is whining at this point."
Huh.  Well if it's just a tired feeling as long as it doesn't make you sleepy, I say just ignore it and keep on relaxing